DANGERMOUSE ///
INTERVIEW MARK GRIFFEY ///
DATE MARCH 11, 2004 ///

Even though he stole his DJ name from a British cartoon's secret agent mouse, this time, the Brits that are after Dangermouse are much more frightening than Baron Silas Greenback.

Dangermouse, who's real name is Brian Burton, was recently hit up with a cease and desist order from EMI, who holds the rights to the Beatles songbook. On his aptly titled Grey Album, Dangermouse mixes Jay-Z's a capella vocals from The Black Album with beats and music culled from the Beatles' White Album into a gleefully disorienting collage that was intended mainly as an experiment, not a money making venture. But that didn't stop EMI from taking notice. And how couldn't they? Every major magazine, Internet site, and news station has run a story on the Grey Album phenomenon at this point, and even though Dangermouse might not be making cash off the Beatles directly, the fame and attention he is getting will surely put him in higher demand as a producer.

But the Grey Album isn't the first mashup he's done and it won't be the last. The Mouse has been in the game for over eight long years - and just before this whole thing blew up, he was garnering a healthy amount of underground cred for his critically lauded Ghetto Pop Life, which features some of 2003's most buoyant and creative production work on a rap album. Gemini's thoroughly average rapping notwithstanding, the success of this album caught the attention of rappers like Cee-Lo, Prince Paul, and MF Doom, all of whom Dangermouse was working with before he completed the Grey Album.

So how is the Grey Album anyway? Is it even good? While it does occasionally succumb to mere novelty, and at other times, it just flat out fails, the album is stunning. At its best, the tracks succeed in finding the funk in the Beatles, which, judging from the lack of Beatles samples in the 20-year history of hip-hop, can be difficult. Especially "Change Clothes," in which Dangermouse pulls a groove out of Harrison's forgettable "Piggies" and makes the catchiest song from The Black Album a standout once again. The heavy hitting scree of "Helter Skelter" is also put to good use on "99 Problems," framing Jay-Z's tirades about racist cops, fame, and evil critics in a swirl of psychedelic funk that gives his lyrics the hard edge they require for maximum effect. The album starts to sag by the end, but Dangermouse himself has admitted the experimental nature of the project has rendered it unlistenable in places. Perhaps because of his newfound notoriety, or perhaps because of a barrage of phone calls from EMI, Dangermouse has become quite difficult to catch on the phone. And yet, somehow, through a bit of persistence and luck, I caught the man on his cell phone while he was driving through Los Angeles for one of many business meetings.

You finally got me.
Yep. It wasn't easy, though.

How has your life changed since you released the Grey Album?
I guess on a daily basis I'm just much, much busier. I haven't been able to do as much music as I usually do. I've had to do more business stuff. I wasn't really set up for the kind of response that this created. But it's still somewhat of a good thing. It's made me realize that I can still be happy with just putting out music. Money is still a secondary thing if you know what I mean, but it's opened me up to a lot of different people. A lot of artists have gotten in touch with me, so it's definitely different than it was before.

Is the success of this project really a surprise though? You've mixed the most famous pop group ever, the Beatles, with one of the most successful rappers in the game, Jay-Z.
Yeah, I'm under no illusions that the interest this has generated has nothing to do with the fact that I used Jay-Z and the Beatles. But still I've done all kinds of mixes with huge people before, like I mixed the Beatles with the Wu-Tang clan and put that on mix CD's and CD-R's. Nothing happened then. Even if the potential is there, it still might not catch on. If this was a set formula or a set thing, that means the next person that mixes Nas with Led Zeppelin is gonna be huge, but that's just not the case. People have been doing mashups for a very long time. This is much more like an artsy kind of record. I thought it was hard on the ears at times, but that was the point. It was very collage-oriented, a very crazy, weird record. So I was very surprised that a lot of people got on to it. I think a big part of that is because of the publicity it got early on and also because it was made unavailable officially and people obviously want what they can't have. I didn't know all that stuff was gonna happen. Dude, I wish I could take credit for planning the whole thing.

I think the title is partly responsible.
I didn't have the title for it until well after it was done. I have friends that have CD-R's that say White Album vs. The Black Album. I never thought of the title Grey Album until it was finished. It just turned into what it turned into, and I just kind of went with it. It was just a fun thing and then this cease-and-desist thing happened. I had never been on MTV or in Rolling Stone before. I never expected to be there. It just so happens that the people at those places really dug it and they also said they knew the Ghetto Pop Life record and other stuff I did before. I didn't know they knew about that stuff, they certainly didn't write about it then. So it was a surprise to me the way it turned out.

Are more rappers coming to you looking for tracks?
Yeah, I'd say so, but I had a lot in place before this whole thing happened. All the projects that I'm involved in right now, the main ones anyway, are ones I had to put on hold so I could finish this. I was in the middle of finishing up that Prince Paul record that I executive produced and did about four or five tracks on there. Me and Gemini were finishing up our follow-up - we're about eight or nine tracks into that. Me and MF Doom just started on a side-project. And me and Cee-Lo had started up a side-project. All these things happened before I even came up with the idea for the Grey Album. So when I was done with the Grey Album, I went right back into business, doing what I was doing. I think it's cool that other people are hollering and more people are open to what I'm doing, but I really just figured it would be more of a cult thing, an underground thing.

Does EMI have a legitimate case against you?
I don't know. I can't really comment on it because I'm in talks with them right now. I'm not really sure what they're looking for. Unfortunately, I knew that technically what I was doing was illegal. I didn't think about that when I did it because I never really planned for it to turn out the way it did.

It's unprecedented, because even though you used the samples, you didn't actually make money off it. All you really got was the notoriety.
It's almost like a cover song. You can have a band that's been busting their ass for two or three albums, and not do anything, then they cover a pop song and it's all over the radio and that's what they'll be known for. That's the last thing I want to be known for. "Oh, you're the guy that did that one thing." I've been doing this for eight years. I took the long route on purpose and the background of being a producer is what I'm trying to do. I'm definitely a behind-the-scenes kind of person. But the more I'm getting involved with other people, be it Gemini or whoever, I've learned that it's necessary to get more people to hear your records to take a couple hits here and there and talk to people and not be so anti-everything. Just as I was getting used to doing this on a small level, this thing happened.

Do you see underground hip-hop getting more mainstream attention, like alternative music did in the early '90s?
I don't know. That's a good question.

People have been bringing it up because of Kanye West. He's sort of got underground and mainstream cred at the same time. Is this sort of attention something indie hip-hop kids want to avoid?
I don't believe that last thing. Hip-hop is so huge right now, nobody has a hold on it. There are so many underground groups. Most underground rappers I know would jump on the next Nas or Jay-Z record in a heartbeat. They would. Why wouldn't they? What you're finding is more of a middle ground. I think the mainstream is embracing the underground more than the other way around.

To me the Grey Album is one-sided. Jay's lyrics mostly play out as they do on the record. They just have new beats. But you cut up the White Album like crazy. Is this record better appreciated by Beatles fans?
People who know me - my friends and artists I work with - weren't surprised by me doing this project. What I was trying to do for my parents and friends in bands who aren't so into hip-hop, was to show them what I do, what can be done with sampling. It is its own art form. You can be creative with it. It's not just looping big things and rapping over it. There can be a lot more to it, although looping a big sample and throwing a beat to it can be hot. I just wanted to see myself if I could do it that way. So yeah, I would say people who really know the White Album and who are fans of hip-hop are really gonna get the most out of it. Some of the songs on there I think can be unlistenable because I was trying so many different things on different songs to see if it would work. Some people like it and some don't. It was a fun project for me, that's all.

What inspires you besides the Beatles and Jay-Z?
Right now I'm very much into a lot of psychedelic and prog stuff like Can. I also like obvious stuff like Isaac Hayes, Pink Floyd and Hendrix. A less obvious choice would be Louis Armstrong. Prince Paul and the Beatminerz are two of my biggest influences in hip-hop. I also like Olivia Tremor Control a lot.

Oh yeah, you're from Athens.
Yeah, I lived there for six years before I moved to London for a couple years. Athens had a big influence on me. That's where I got into all the psychedelic experimental stuff. I worked with John Hernandez from the Olivia Tremor Control at the record store there [Wuxtry] and he'd give me tons of stuff to listen to. I was a straight up hip-hop kid when I got there but years later there was so much more to it. I'm just trying to continue to make records and push boundaries a little bit. If the commercial thing comes, it comes. That's why I'm trying to look at this whole thing positively because it'll let me do what I want to do. ///

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Last year, a DJ decked out in a rodent costume made headlines by composing a mash-up bootleg of lyrics from Jay-Z's Black Album with the music from the Beatles'

Since Dangermouse gave us the Gray Album and this undeniably universe-shattering event took place, any idiot with a burnt copy of Pro Tools mixing software and too much time to spare has been mashing up poor Jay-Z with everything from Weezer's Blue Album to their niece's piano recital. Not people to be upstaged by, well, anyone really, we here at 'Sup have a few suggestions of our own for albums to be mashed together with Jay-Z.

FEY-Z
MASHED WITH DASHBOARD CONFESSIONAL'S A MARK, A MISSION, A BRAND, A SCAR
"I got 99 problems/but a bitch ain't one" becomes "I've got 99 problems/One of which is that there's this girl I totally dig in American Lit/But when I called her she hung up on me/So I cried."

VIVA HATERZ
MASHED WITH MORRISSEY'S VIVA HATE
Blending two of the best lyricists the world has to offer, and you're sure to have come across bona-fide classic. "Every Lay is Like Beyonce", perhaps? We would hope so.

THE THIN BLACK DUKE
MASHED WITH THE RISE AND FALL OF ZIGGY STARDUST AND THE SPIDERS FROM MARS
Scientists have proven it to be physically impossible to even imagine Jigga in glam make-up.

JAY-FREEK!
MASHED WITH PRINCE'S DIRTY MIND
Tentative song titles include "Change Clothes (So I Can See You Nekkid)" and "(That 12-Minute Orgasm We Just Had Was a Moment of Clarity."

YOU FORGOT TO BUST A CAP IN PEOPLE
MASHED WITH BROKEN SOCIAL SCENE'S YOU FORGOT IT IN PEOPLE
Somehow, blending Jay-Z with, like, a million Canadian indie rockers seems urgently necessary. And let's face it. The phrase "bust a cap" is damn funny.

DOO A LITTLE TIME
MASHED WITH PIXIES' DOOLITTLE
Jay-Z warns Beyonce that "here comes your man" while Black Francis sings "la la love you" because he too is reportedly crazy in love.

GIVE THE DAWG A BONE
MASHED WITH AC/DC'S BACK IN BLACK
"Angus" is the Australian equivalent of Bubba. "Jay-Z" is the Australian equivalent of Jigga. Coincidence? We think not. Bonus: Jay-Z worked with R. Kelly who likes 'em young and AC/DC has guitarist Angus Young.

I DON'T WANNA WALK AROUND WITH NAS
MASHED WITH THE RAMONES' ROCKET TO RUSSIA
Just imagine the autobiographical input Jay could bring to "Rockaway Beach"!

JAY-SWEDE
MASHED WITH ABBA'S GOLD
Two words: Roller rink.

AND FINALLY JAY-Z'S BLACK ALBUM CROSSED WITH
JAY-Z'S BLACK ALBUM
Seriously, why hasn't anyone thought of this? You know that scene in Being John Malkovich when John Malkovich enters his own mind and wakes up in that tricked out "Malkovich-Malkovich" dreamworld? That's what this would be like. Only everything would look like the ultimate episode of "Cribs."